Episode 34: All About Service Dogs with Rebuilding Warriors Founder Jeff Anderson

00;00;09;01 – 00;01;18;00
Kelly Parbs
Welcome to OnTopic with Empathia. I’m your host, Kelly Parbs. Today on the show, we will be talking about dogs. Not just any kind of dogs, but service dogs! These dogs are highly trained to perform specific tasks for individuals or groups of people with various types of disabilities. And who better to talk with than a man who has been training service dogs for over 12 years? Jeff Anderson is the CEO and founder of Rebuilding Warriors. He handpicks, evaluates, and trains each dog for the specific needs of veterans and other recipients. He goes through a comprehensive pairing process to make sure each dog and handler are paired for success. This includes dogs for amputees, those diagnosed with PTSD, with mental health challenges, traumatic brain injuries, and more. These dogs change and save lives. Let’s meet Jeff Anderson. Hello, Jeff, and thank you for joining me today!

00;01;18;03 – 00;01;20;14
Jeff Anderson
Good morning, and thank you for having me!

00;01;20;18 – 00;01;46;12
Kelly Parbs
Absolutely! So most of us have seen people with service dogs, but many of us really don’t know what goes into having or training one. I’m hoping that you can shed some light on the world of service dogs for our listeners and for me today. How about we start with you telling us about Rebuilding Warriors and what led you to start this organization?

00;01;46;14 – 00;06;16;05
Jeff Anderson
Well, long story longer, I don’t know- the beginning of the war, I, was living in California outside of March Air Force Base. They had abandoned their, Air Force housing, and the Marine Corps had turned it into what they call the war fighting lab. So they had not really done house to house fighting since Vietnam. And so it was a way of training young Marines, about urban warfare. And, I happened to be standing in my friend’s office at the sheriff’s headquarters, and this Marine Corps captain said, I wish we could find somebody to teach us how to do dignitary protection. Well, I had been to school for that in the army and in civilian world. And I said, hey, I can teach you! And the guy goes, who the hell are you? And I said, well, who the hell are you? And, you know, everybody laughed. And, I ended up putting on classes, 25 to 50 Marines at a time. We trained about 700 Marines for free and, you know, it was over a course of several months. And, Pat Kline, who was a lieutenant colonel, Dave Herron, Todd Whitman, they ran the, facility. Well, one of the commanders that went through wanted to hire, second time before he redeployed. So we actually started getting paid for contracts and, that’s my introduction to the Marine Corps. I’m an Army guy. I did 15 years in the Army, and I ran a, a long range surveillance unit, active duty. And then as a reservist, I was the first sergeant for a prisoner of war processing company. And, so we did we did that. And when we got done, in training, the Marines would deploy for nine months. They would come back, and the first weekend was always a four day weekend for them. So we invited several Marines to our house from that unit. there’s 28 guys, and I think, like, 17 of them showed up at our house for a little barbecue. And this young kid asked me, hey, Mr. Anderson, could you train a service dog for me? And they had lost several Marines during the deployment. And out of the 28 guys that I trained, almost every one of them has a Purple Heart! You know, and I told this kid, hey, I don’t know anything about service dogs. Get off my lawn! I don’t- I only do, bite dogs. That’s all I knew was police dogs and military bite dogs. But, before he left, I decided, you know what? I’m going to help this kid out. So we trained a dog for him, and it ended up working out. So I trained 12 dogs on my own. out of our own pocket, my wife and I. And then, about 12 dogs into it, I realized I’m a good man, but I’m not a good business man. Because I was 10 to $1000 in debt, and, you know, it cost money to do this! Sure! So I started a nonprofit, and, none of us take a paycheck. It’s all operational money. Right now, we we’re 151 dogs in 38 states. And that that’s what we have out there. And, whatever you want to give credit or take credit away, you know, inflation is inflation. And what used to cost $9,000 is almost $13,000 a dog now. And, you know, that includes travel, hotel, you know, basic home set up all that stuff and and pass through price to the dog. So airfare, you know, it all adds up. Sure. So it’s about $13,000 to do a dog. And, we are just chugging away!

00;06;16;06 – 00;06;39;01
Kelly Parbs
So let me just stop here and say thank you, Jeff, for your service in the military. And it sounds to me like you didn’t necessarily set out to be someone who trains service dogs, but because of the circumstances you were in, you stumbled upon it and found out that it’s something that you are good at and that there’s a great need for!

00;06;39;01 – 00;09;43;26
Jeff Anderson
Well, I, I worked at the largest kennel west of the Mississippi, and we did a lot of special operations dogs for the military and serviced about 250 police departments. Well, those dogs are, you know, basically their protection dogs. They, they they bite. They you know, some of them are dual purpose. They find bombs or drugs or, you know, whatever, cadaver. but most, most of them are patrol dogs that bite. And, so I had no knowledge of the service world at all. And when that kid asked me if I could help him, I, I mean, it was a learning curve for me as well, but thank goodness I have friends who did this for a living, and they sort of steered me in the right direction. And I, I do do it differently than a lot of organizations. And, you know, if you don’t like the way we do it, start your own. That’s what I tell people, you know, and I, the way we do it is I find you. What’s wrong with you? What? What do you think a dog will do for you? And then what kind of dog do you want? Well, if you told me you wanted a Labrador, that’s what I’m going to get you. I’m not going to give you, a mutt that trained out of the pound. Because I want you to love the dog that I’m giving you. And so, most of my dogs are labs and shepherds. It just seems to be what people ask for. I have a couple Goldens. I actually have one standard poodle. I really have no- what would be considered a mutt, dog. You know, people are people, and they ask for what they want so that I don’t knock anybody. You know, if you could clean out the shelters, God love you! But I did not have a lot of luck with shelter dogs. I was- I found myself I was five for 15, and, you know, and. Yeah, well, you saved five dogs. Yeah, but I spent a lot of your money and a lot of my time for no reason. Right? That’s the way I look at it. I mean, it’s it’s your money and it’s my time. Sure. So if I’m not going to be 100% successful, why am I doing it? Sure. And so I decided that I was going to purchase dogs from people that bred for service work. And since I’ve done that, I’ve only washed three out of the last 125 dogs. Wow. I mean, that that that that’s pretty good record, really. And, and actually out of those three, I would have to blame the handler for two of those.

00;09;43;27 – 00;09;44;16
Kelly Parbs
I see.

00;09;44;18 – 00;10;17;18
Jeff Anderson
They just got lazy and didn’t follow through the way they should have. But- but we, we ended up correcting the issue and we were, you know, we we actually one of the dogs is at my house. I just kept it. Okay. it was, borderline age, you know, four and a half, five years old that I can’t give that dog to anybody at that point. So, Yeah, that that’s where that’s how we do it. And I think it works out pretty well for everybody!

00;10;17;21 – 00;10;28;09
Kelly Parbs
So you touched on one of the questions I had for you. I was wondering how people are referred to you or how you find the recipients that you work with.

00;10;28;11 – 00;12;06;12
Jeff Anderson
Out of the first, I’ll say they haven’t maybe 60, are all people that I actually had my hands on, whether I trained them for police work, whether I trained them for the military. or they had friends who were in the same unit and they were directed to me. That’s how we- that’s how I did probably the first 50 people. And then we started getting, across the country. People were starting to hear about us. And even now, if you go to the website, we don’t have, an application online. Like, I make people work. You want a dog, you’re going to have to do a little work! And that work is, Hey, how do I get a hold of you? Hey, how do I apply for a dog? How do I, you know, you know, the veteran community is a little bit spoiled at this point because they think everybody’s going to wait on them hand and foot. And I could talk bad about them because I’m one of them. And, I’m like some things in life, you have to work for and and for me, I’m putting my child into your home. So I got to make sure you’re invested! And, so, I mean, we, my application is pretty simple, and, but on the other half is I- I don’t do any of the work for you initially. You – you’ll have to- you’ll have to do the legwork.

00;12;06;14 – 00;12;48;16
Kelly Parbs
So when I think about veterans, I often think about post-traumatic stress disorder, although certainly not all veterans of course, will have that diagnosis. We know that some of the criteria for PTSD diagnosis is that the symptoms have to be present for more than a month, and those symptoms interfere with daily living. They might include things like flashbacks, nightmares, anger, aggression, depression, anxiety, suicidal thoughts, and much more. Can you give us some examples of how a service dog might help someone with some of those specific symptoms of PTSD?

00;12;48;18 – 00;16;17;15
Jeff Anderson
Absolutely, absolutely. I, I joke with, almost all my recipients about dealing with the angriest men and women on the planet, right? I mean, they they really have trying to fit back into civilian society is a tough thing when everything you do is structured in the military. So I tell you where to be. And so if I tell you we have formation at 5:00, it really means like 4:30. You need to roll up there. You know, you’re always going to be early. You’re never going to be five minutes late. And things in the military are very much structured. And it’s a lot of micromanaging, and it’s a lot of, detail, small, small details. And then you go into civilian world and nothing works the same! People don’t have your back like they do in the military. Your fellow workers will throw you under the bus to make themselves look good, because you know what you don’t have that in the military. And, it’s just a different. It’s a lifestyle change, really. And these guys get out and they start to fall apart, they- they no longer have a mission, their identity. You know, I, I just gave a dog to a sergeant major that had 27 years in the special forces. Here’s the guy that you know was the tip of the spear for 27 years! And then all of a sudden he’s out and he’s nobody. I mean, one day he’s in charge of, you know, a thousand Special Forces guys, and the next day he’s nobody. He’s just a guy. And so you lose that identity and, you know that a lot of the anger. And anger comes, you know, conflict. Most- most of the angry guys I deal with are combat veterans or, military sexual trauma. Those two things, you know, and I get a lot of I have a lot of females, that are recipients. And, they’re not all sexual trauma, but a lot of them are. And, you know, one thing you learn about an animal is if you love it, it loves you. And even, and if you don’t love it, it will love you! And it breaks down. As simple as that is. It breaks down that wall, that barrier. You know, we try so hard to put our guard up so we don’t get our heart broken again. I don’t want to make friends because every time I make a friend, I lose a friend. And you sort of become an island. Well, if I give you a dog that that dog doesn’t care, it’s going to greet you at the door every time you walk in, like it hasn’t seen you in a million years. And it may be only five minutes. And it really does help them reintegrate back into- I call them simple emotions, you know, love and honor and, you know, just, that sense of self-worth, and I, I really believe that, animals find a way to your heart. So, that’s where I think they really help out.

00;16;17;18 – 00;16;29;27
Kelly Parbs
So when you are thinking about the impact of the work that you do, are there any particular stories of veterans and their success that come to mind?

00;16;29;29 – 00;18;25;09
Jeff Anderson
I have a lot of success stories and even, you know, even- even the ones that aren’t super successful are successful. You know, if- if you have not had a relationship with your wife or- I had a young man, he had three kids under the age of five and got deployed for 18 months, came back, could not interact with kids, could not interact with his family. We gave him a dog and now he’s like father of the year, you know? So to me that is a true success story, but on a bigger scale, I have, I have a guy, Mike Barker. Mike was a, combat medic, got out of the military, stayed in the San Antonio area as a home health physical therapist, and, but he just was not feeling, like, worthy, I guess, all the way worthy. And, so he got involved in Purple Heart baseball and doing things like that. But again, if you don’t like the way some things run, well, go start your own, you know? So Mike started a nonprofit called Heroes Sports, and now he’s in 40 states? And he does sports from bow hunting to golf, baseball, softball, football. And they do it all. And they have ambassadors and, you know, all these states and it’s it’s several thousand veterans that are playing sports because of Mike Barker. You know, and I think that that’s a huge success story to me. I mean, you have a guy who had zero self-worth and then he realizes I can help somebody else, like somebody helped me!

00;18;25;12 – 00;18;29;05
Kelly Parbs
Not only was he helped, but now he’s helping so many others!

00;18;29;12 – 00;18;32;18
Jeff Anderson
Yeah! He really has paid it way, way forward!

00;18;32;20 – 00;19;02;26
Kelly Parbs
Jeff, you had mentioned that you custom trained these dogs for their recipient and what the recipient needs. What are some of the easier or maybe some of the more difficult tasks to specifically train a dog for, for instance, like, I can’t even wrap my mind around how hard it would be to train a dog to know that a medical event is happening. Can you- can you tell us some of the specifics?

00;19;02;29 – 00;20;30;28
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, we- we, we have dogs. The second dog I gave away, I actually trained myself. His name was Bo. He’s a German shepherd. And, his his handler was the field artillery guy who got caught in between a mortar attack of several mortars. And when they did an MRI of his brain, his brain actually looked like Swiss cheese- it has big a holes in it. And, so he had applied for, a mortgage free home, and they gave him one and I believe it was in New Mexico. So he packed up from Texas. Then he moved to New Mexico, and he’s moving in and his dog starts barking uncontrollably, barking. And the neighbor next door is like, oh, no, I’m not putting up with this guy! You know, this guy’s just moving in! I’m not listening to this! So he sticks his head over the fence to he yell at Brandon, and Brandon is purple having a major grand mal seizure, and the dog is alerting to that. And, so the guy called the, ambulance. The ambulance came. They brought Brandon to the hospital, and they said that had- had no one come, who knows what would have happened to him?

00;20;31;03 – 00;20;31;16
Kelly Parbs
Sure!

00;20;31;20 – 00;22;27;08
Jeff Anderson
I mean, he was going- he wasn’t really breathing correctly, and, so he, you know, that- that we have dogs that can detect seizures. We have, two diabetic alert dogs, where if your blood sugar is really low or really high, they’ll alert. But we- Now I just refer those dogs out. It’s a lot of work to do. Diabetic alert dogs. It’s a lot! We have, several. I think nine double leg amputees. And those guys, you know, you just have to figure, if you drop a can of peas, what do you do? You bend over and pick it up. Well, if they drop a can of peas, they have to get out of their wheelchair to go get it! And so we have dogs that can retrieve credit cards, dimes. You know, a can of peas! Kevin Dubois, his first day he got the dog, he went shopping, and he dropped a bottle of shampoo, and the dog picked it up for him. And he was like, that is an independence that I forgot I even had! You know, he’s so used to having to have people help him that, you know, the dog could finally do that for him. I, I have guys who are in wheelchairs on college campuses, which are gigantic and, you know, some of those ramps are pretty steep! You know, a dog can actually help them get up the ramp by pulling the wheelchair, opening the doors for them. They- they, they learn how to hit, the handicap buttons and actually open the doors for you.

00;22;27;11 – 00;22;32;15
Kelly Parbs
Are there different breeds of dogs that are better for different disability?

00;22;32;15 – 00;23;51;10
Jeff Anderson
Most of my dogs are shepherds or labs. I have, two golden retrievers and a poodle and that- that’s really it. I for a while I was giving Mal’s away Malinois, but I realized very quickly, and I have done Malinois my whole life. I actually own four of them. So to me, they’re they’re part of my family. But to the average person, they’re a lot of work and veterans on a whole are I guess, sort of lazy. And they don’t want to do all that exercise or whatever it takes to keep these dogs motivated. And, you know, if you if you don’t find a job for your dog, it finds employment that you don’t like. And you know that employment is usually destruction of your stuff or, you know, and maybe it gets defensive. Maybe it starts guarding you and doesn’t let people approach you or whatever. So I stopped giving Malinois away, and I think I did, you know, I’m fine with that decision, but I just can’t be giving a dog away to take it back in six months because you were lazy and didn’t do your homework.

00;23;51;15 – 00;24;00;07
Kelly Parbs
Sure! You had mentioned the average cost of training a dog, I think you said was around $13,000?

00;24;00;09 – 00;26;45;19
Jeff Anderson
That’s, that’s not just training, though. That, that’s total cost, okay? So that equipment, that’s the purchase price of the puppy, the training of a year, a year, anywhere from a year to a year and a half of training, the delivery to that recipient’s home, and that’s usually the trainer and, representative of Rebuilding Warriors. And I’ll explain why two people go here in a second and, and then, you know, the meals and the hotel stays and the rental cars and, you know, all that stuff. So it all adds up and it comes out to about $13,000. But we always send two people. Now you’ve- you’ve had a dog that you’ve been training with us for a year. Well, that that dog looks at you as, as the pack leader. You are it! Well, so now I bring that dog to Massachusetts and I’m going to give it to Joe Slappy. Well, Joe shows up. That dog doesn’t know Joe from anybody. It knows you! So every time you tell it to do something, it looks at you. If Joe tells you something, it looks at you. So what we do is we have the trainer for two days work with the hand, the new recipient. You know, this is- this is the command. This is what it’s for. This is what it to expect from the dog. This is what the dog should do. This is what you should do. And then, what happens is the third day. The handler is nowhere to be had. Now it’s a representative from Rebuilding Warriors who are all trained as dog trainers. And, now you’ve been feeding the dog for 2 to 3 days, and, you know, it sleeps with you for 2 or 3 days at your house for 2 or 3 days. And now all of a sudden the trainer is not there. Who is it looking for for direction? You can’t – we’ve implemented that program. We’ve had great success with that. And, really, I, I tell everybody in five days that dog is yours. You know, it doesn’t matter if I’ve had it for a year. And my big joke is in four days, I’ll take anybody’s dog and make it mine. And I’ve heard over and over and over, no, not my dog! Not my dog! Well, I proved that wrong many, many times.

00;26;45;22 – 00;26;52;19
Kelly Parbs
Are there resources to help fund this for people who maybe don’t have that $13,000 to spend?

00;26;52;21 – 00;27;34;04
Jeff Anderson
We- we don’t charge! If you get a dog from us, everything is paid for from donations, private donations. And I only have a couple, I have a couple companies. Anheuser-Busch gave us some money. Chevron has given us some money. Colgate once gave us some money, but as far as big corporations, we don’t have that. We have patriotic Americans that a little money a lot is how we make our money, and that’s it.

00;27;34;06 – 00;27;42;05
Kelly Parbs
And so if our listeners wanted to donate so that someone could have a trained service dog, how would they go about doing that?

00;27;42;08 – 00;28;59;13
Jeff Anderson
Well, you go to the website or Facebook, it’s www.rebuildingwarriors.com, www.rebuilding warriors.com. Or you could send us a check and the addresses are on both. And that’s how we do it! We have two big fundraisers a year. One of them is in new Jersey, Del Mar, new Jersey. And that’s coming up in May. that a, a nightclub called The Headliner. It’s, Sundays and it’s like from 12 to 5 and, you know, we do pretty well there and then I live in Texas, and I basically open my property. I have a huge obstacle course in the pallet pile and directional control and all kinds of- it’s the perfect property for dogs. And I have, about 250 business men, business women and ranchers. and I have a crawfish boil barbecue at my house and, you know, with silent auction items and- Yeah, those are our two big fundraisers.

00;28;59;16 – 00;29;07;20
Kelly Parbs
And in an average year, do you fundraise enough money for as many dogs as you are able to train?

00;29;07;22 – 00;30;50;03
Jeff Anderson
We- we have never done less than ten dogs in a year. but we have done as many as 20 dogs in a year. And I mean, the funny part to that is, I consider us very small! You know, we we we do what we do. Nobody takes a paycheck except the people that have the dogs for a year, year and a half. We pay them, but it’s still minimal compared to what other people are making. People make more in 2 or 3 months than we pay our people for a year! But everybody, for me, is in it for the right reason, and they’re in it for the veterans and not to line their pockets. And I mean it- it hurts when you hear that. But, you know, nobody in my organization is making six digits, you know, we’re not worth millions of dollars. Even the companies that are, they put out less dogs than we do in a week! So, you know, you got to look at that with a take a step back and go, what? Yeah. Why is that? You know, so we don’t have, I’m very fortunate that my property is ten acres with a huge barn and, you know, all the facilities. And my wife trains, search and rescue dogs, for FEMA and, she work for FEMA, but she’s part of FEMA, and she does cadaver dogs and live find dogs. So a lot of the facilities are dual. And, you know, we’re very fortunate in that aspect.

00;30;50;06 – 00;30;57;16
Kelly Parbs
When you and I were scheduling to do this recording, you mentioned that your mornings are very busy with the dogs.

00;30;57;19 – 00;30;59;20
Jeff Anderson
My life, my life is very busy!

00;30;59;20 – 00;31;06;12
Kelly Parbs
Your life is very busy! Can you tell us what an average day at your property looks like?

00;31;06;14 – 00;32;58;02
Jeff Anderson
Yeah. In a- in the summertime, we’ll- we’ll go with the summertime because it gets light at, you know, 530, 6:00 and, usually as soon as it gets light, we feed around six in the morning, and by 7:30, everybody’s out in their holding areas and kennels, and, they all sleep in my house. All 14 dogs, 15 dogs sleep in my house. And then, we move them outside and from my barn, it’s indoor. Outdoor. Well, indoor, they, they can sit in there under a giant fan. And if it’s night, they can go walk through a little opening and they it’s a bunch of open kennels that look into the backyard. Well, they can watch all the other dogs work. So if you’re doing direction control or you’re on a big- I have a pallet pile. It’s about 3400 pallets that are just thrown everywhere. And it looks it’s supposed to replicate a house or something that’s been blown over while we hide odor in there. We hide kids in there, and I have a giant obstacle course and all the dogs do the obstacles and all their dogs know direction control with hand signals. So no matter where you are on my property, the dogs that are in the barn can watch you. And I really think there’s a benefit to that. And, you know, they all want to work and they all want to participate. So we usually come in around 7:00 at night, 6:30 at night. Make a stop for lunch, you know, long enough to eat a sandwich and right back out.

00;32;58;02 – 00;33;00;15
Kelly Parbs
It sounds like a lot of hard work!

00;33;00;17 – 00;34;50;01
Jeff Anderson
It it’s- it’s work, but it’s it’s necessary work, you know, and, you know, service dogs, they don’t use the same training that the search dogs use, but they still- you have to bring them out. You have to get them in public. You have to get them on escalators, elevators. there’s, in the malls, in the airport, places that are very, very busy, very crowded, public transportation. You know, the first time, I gave a, I gave the guy from New York City a dog. I live in a horse town. I honestly, it was 19,000 people and 24,000 horses. And so had we not done our work, and I had just shown up in New York City, with, with this dog, we would have been, a lot of egg on our face. So I, I, I take pride in that, you know, all that stuff gets done before you get your dog. But every day, and again, you know, I live in a horse town. Even now, I live in a town of 4500 people. I don’t live in a metropolis anymore. And, so every day is a training day. I may give you a dog, and I don’t live near any malls. So maybe you live near a mall. So you have the chance to go in an elevator, go in an elevator! You know, I mean, every day you have the opportunity to teach something new to your dog, you should be teaching it!

00;34;50;04 – 00;35;03;01
Kelly Parbs
You really have to get a good sense of who the handler is and what their lifestyle is like, so that you can appropriately train that dog to be able to adapt and help in that lifestyle.

00;35;03;03 – 00;36;59;18
Jeff Anderson
That- that’s correct! And so what happens is I train that dog. Let me just say, if I’m training it in Texas, okay? I train that dog for you. You’re a single leg amputee and you are a public speaker and you have three kids. So I get the dog near as many kids as they can. Soccer games, baseball games. You know what? Any kind of sporting event, And anything I can do near children, we do. Then I do the same thing with, you know, loudspeakers, music, anything that’s going to replicate public speaking. Then I would take the dog to any- anything I can do to pretend like we’re in an Uber. Pretend we’re, you know, on a bus. I know, and when I’m pretending, I get on a bus. And, you know, bring it to the airport and shuttle it around. And then we fly the dog to you. The dog is trained. Now I have five days to train you! And and that’s the hardest part. It’s not training the dog. It’s training the handler to use the dog the right way. And you know, some some of the my handlers have never had a dog. So it’s a whole new experience for the whole family. And, you know, it may take a little bit longer or it may take a little bit shorter. So we- we have had several handlers where this was like their fourth or fifth dog. So they, they’re good with dogs and they, they pick it up right away. But you know, whatever it takes we’re going to leave. When we leave, you will feel confident about your ability with the dog.

00;36;59;20 – 00;37;04;12
Kelly Parbs
And do you follow up then with these handlers and stay in touch with them?

00;37;04;14 – 00;38;23;12
Jeff Anderson
Yes we do. I will tell you, I am not- I am not the guy that is going to exploit my handlers. You asked me questions about a couple people, and I had already cleared it with them that I was going to talk about them, and- but for the most part, I’ll call them, especially the first year, I really try to, yeah how are things going? Any issues, anything we can do? Any problems? And we’ve- I’ve gone- I’ve gone to Phenix, Arizona twice to help a guy with a dog. He’s in college. He’s been- he’s- he’s in his late 30s. But he decided he was going to go back to school, and he was having trouble with his dog. And it really wasn’t the dog. It was him. And then once we got once we got there and we fixed the problem in a- in an hour and a half, you know, but he, he was completely stressed out about it. And to me, I just think if you take time and make it enjoyable for the recipient, it’s enjoyable for everybody. You know, a well-trained dog is a joy to be around, so-

00;38;23;14 – 00;38;31;09
Kelly Parbs
Yes! How long does the average service dog work and like, do they retire at some point?

00;38;31;09 – 00;39;07;06
Jeff Anderson
Ooh! Well, it’s funny, I, I’m in my office and I actually, have a dog. She’s 14, and, this is their first year of not being able to get around or- or do things. You know, he he’s a little slow going at this point, but, I would say eight years old, 8 or 9 years old is that average retirement age. They start moving a little bit slower or, you know, just start having issues.

00;39;07;08 – 00;39;12;13
Kelly Parbs
And then what what typically happens with them? Do they stay with their handler, or…?

00;39;12;13 – 00;39;32;11
Jeff Anderson
Absolutely! That dog belongs to you! I, I gave that dog to you. And you know, I don’t we don’t take back a dog unless you neglect it or abuse it. Other than that, it belongs to you and your family. And that that’s how we work.

00;39;32;13 – 00;39;42;09
Kelly Parbs
So what would you say is the biggest misconception that the average person might have about service dogs?

00;39;42;12 – 00;40;56;06
Jeff Anderson
That they’re circus dogs, not service dogs, you know, what tricks doesn’t know what? You know, can it, can it shake, can it do this? Can it do that? And we’re like these, these are service dogs. They’re not circus dogs. They’re not they. They don’t do that. They provide a service to this individual. And I think that’s the- for me, that’s the biggest misconception. And you know, you- you could- you could go across America right now and ask any service dog handler, tell me about your experience at the airport. And I guarantee 90% of them would roll their eyes because while you’re at the airport, there are so many fake service dogs or people that just don’t want to board their dog. And you, you’ll- you’ll see, they bark. They’re on 40ft. retractable leashes. They’re all over the place, you know, jumping on people and doing all the stuff that service dogs don’t do.

00;40;56;08 – 00;41;04;26
Kelly Parbs
Have you ever had to educate or be, like, assertive with members of the public when you were handling a service dog?

00;41;04;28 – 00;42;34;12
Jeff Anderson
A lot! A lot more than I care to admit! You get a lot of people who, you know, people love dogs, people love dogs. And the the big joke in my house is I have a Malinois, she’s 48 pounds. she’s cute. And people go, oh, I have one just like it! Only mine’s a poodle. I have one just like it. Only mine’s the cocker spaniel, you know. Yeah. So you don’t have one that’s just like it! You just happen to have a dog is what you have, right? And, But we- we have people who will allow their children to walk over and hug our dogs, face to face with our dogs. And I’m like, who does that? You know, you don’t know this dog from Adam and this dog, you know, at the- at the- you’ve been together for a while. They do get a little bit protective. And they do understand your body language. And, you know, people want to pet dogs. And I tell everybody, all you have to do is ask the average person, my, they you might have a guy or two or a woman or two that say, no, my dog’s working right now. And if you’re, you know, you’re dealing with somebody with limited vision or somebody with, limited mobility, that dog needs to focus on that person and not on you or your kids!

00;42;34;12 – 00;42;53;17
Kelly Parbs
I’m glad that you addressed that, because that was one of my questions for you- as as a member of the general population, what should I know about dog etiquette? If I’m in an airport or at a restaurant and I see a dog that I believe is a service dog, what is the proper etiquette? Is it okay to say, may I pet your dog?

00;42;53;19 – 00;44;31;09
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, absolutely! And, you know, some say do not pet, some say ask before you pet. You know? And I always say, hey, all you gotta do is ask. The worst thing I can say is no, right? And some people don’t want to hear No, but, you know, and, you know, it is a chore if you suffer from PTSD or PTS or anxiety or whatever, being in an airport, traveling with a dog is stressful. And so you already have, yeah, you’re maxed out already. And then you have all these people that want to, you know, they’re not doing it to be a pain in the butt, they just really love animals! And I tell everybody, my service dog is your therapy dog, right? And you’re in an airport. You don’t like traveling either. But if you can pet my dog, maybe you’ll feel a little bit better. So I, I, I’m to the point now where I don’t have a problem with that. I do have a problem with very loud children or rambunctious three year olds that are running amok. You know, I, it really bothers me when parents just don’t care. Like they they don’t realize that things could go bad. Right? And it doesn’t matter. It’s a dog. And, you know, but if you poke my service dog in the eye, I’m not saying it’s going to work out for you.

00;44;31;14 – 00;44;34;22
Kelly Parbs
Sure. Sure! So be aware of your children and-

00;44;34;22 – 00;44;35;18
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, exactly!

00;44;35;21 – 00;44;41;17
Kelly Parbs
– if your child wants to pet that dog, then ask and respect whatever answer you’re given.

00;44;41;17 – 00;44;43;28
Jeff Anderson
That- that’s correct.

00;44;44;00 – 00;44;51;20
Kelly Parbs
Can we talk about dogs that people call service dogs, but they really haven’t been trained in the way that you’ve been telling us about?

00;44;51;20 – 00;45;58;09
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, yeah. The pseudo service dog? It’s at a point now where the airlines are not allowed to say anything to people. And I, you know, I had a- I had a lady who had a, honest to goodness, a if it weighed 2 pounds, it was overweight, poodle that barked the entire length the of the jetway, barked the whole way up on a retractable leash. And I’m standing there with my dog, waiting in line, and she let that dog run right up into my dog’s junk. And, I’m like, what are you doing? Get your fake service dog away from us! And all of a sudden, a gate attendant comes over and I’m like, I’m going to get kicked off of this flight for saying something! And, the lady walked up and told me, thank you, I’m not allowed to say anything! So I think that’s where we are in America right now.

00;45;58;09 – 00;46;04;14
Kelly Parbs
So you- you can’t question people if they say their animal is a service animal.

00;46;04;17 – 00;47;40;13
Jeff Anderson
Well, now you, several of the airlines have made it a little bit more difficult to travel. So American Airlines, you have to fill the paperwork out for every flight before you leave. Your dog is, I guess that in a way, you fill out this paperwork, you know, with the shot records and all that stuff, and then they actually call the facility that trained your dog. So I get a lot of calls that- that’s how I know about that. And then, United Airlines, you have to fill out the Department of Transportation form, but you can do it right at the counter, and then you fly with your dog. So, I haven’t flown, Frontier or Southwest in quite some time, but I know you have to fill out the form as well, but I don’t know that any of them vet the training that’s going on, you know, or or never went on, actually you, because you’re allowed to train according to the ADA, you’re allowed to train your own service dog. Well, that that brings problems to itself. Not saying that if you have a problem that you don’t want your dog to do the best you can do. I’m just saying there’s people that use that as their advantage.

00;47;40;20 – 00;47;58;18
Kelly Parbs
Sure. In reading about different types of service animals, I learned that there are also facility dogs! You and I have been talking about dogs who are trained to help individuals. Can you tell us a little bit about what a facility service dog might be?

00;47;58;18 – 00;49;31;09
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, I, I actually have a good friend. He was, lead trainer for Bella’s Buddies in Crockett, Texas. They provided facility dogs to schools, hospitals. And so what it is that a dog that goes in the classrooms, whether autistic kids or whatever. And, those dogs provide comfort for many people. Five, five people, eight people, ten people. And, you know, it’s not just assigned to one person. It’s there for everybody. It’s like- it’s like a critical incident dog. You know, you you you have something terrible happened. whether it’s a mass shooting or whatever, you bring a dog there and, you know, not just one person is going to hug that dog or hug that dog. It’s going to be touched by everybody that’s having a hard time. So those are what facility dogs are for. And, I guess, and, you know, my service dog becomes your therapy dog, right? And I, I, I have never, I’ve been around the training for them, but I’ve never run a facility dog, so I can’t really speak firsthand to it. That’s all I know about them.

00;49;31;12 – 00;49;51;26
Kelly Parbs
Well, I think you know, Jeff, that’s my job title. I’m a critical incident responder, and I’m not too proud to tell you that I’ve been in more than one situation where a victim of a tragedy had the choice of talking to a dog or coming to talk with me, and they chose the dog. It’s happened more than once!

00;49;51;29 – 00;49;56;01
Jeff Anderson
Well, that’s because you could trust the dog!

00;49;56;04 – 00;49;58;25
Kelly Parbs
I’m not going to take offense!

00;49;58;27 – 00;50;23;00
Jeff Anderson
You know, I tell everybody, if you’re, if you’re a parent and your kids are anywhere from 9 to 13, every- every kid needs a dog. I, I grew up in, a really tough setting. and I can remember telling every secret I ever had to my dogs.

00;50;23;00 – 00;50;23;17
Kelly Parbs
Sure.

00;50;23;21 – 00;50;39;27
Jeff Anderson
And, I don’t know that that’s a bad thing. You know, everybody needs, a sounding board. And for a lot of kids, that’s not people. And, you know, which is sad in itself, but it’s a reality.

00;50;40;01 – 00;51;07;14
Kelly Parbs
Sure! And I think I, I think you have something there because when I am at these tragedies and, and again, maybe someone would rather spend some time with the dog than with me, you know, maybe they’re thinking this dog is not going to be judgmental. This dog can’t break confidentiality. They can’t make me talk about my feelings when I don’t want to and they just feel like they can be themselves with no expectations. Just be in that case.

00;51;07;16 – 00;52;52;27
Jeff Anderson
Well, when I lived in California, I used to bring my dog to a, basically an autism class, once a week. And I, I’m trying to learn, the service dog thing back then, this is way back 12 years ago. Ten years ago. And I’m just trying to figure out how dogs are going to fit into the lives of veterans. And what can I do to be a better trainer? Those type of things, and there was a young man whose name was Peter, and he was in seventh grade and not uttered one word, not a word, like his parents never heard him use a sentence, right? So I brought this- I brought this dog. I had a big German Shepherd and his name was Gunner. And he weighed about 110 pounds. And I brought Gunner into this room with four kids, and they’re petting and, you know, you’re you’re teaching them how to pet, some of them are very hard hitting. Some of them are long strokes. And, you know, you’re teaching these kids how to pet a dog, how to respect a dog. And, you know, just trying to talk to them. And, one day the teacher said, hey, would you mind staying outside and just let your dog in with Peter? And I- I was like, yeah, I, I trust my dog. So we did. And we had Peter on a speaker and you could see him on a camera. And Peter was full-on talking to that dog.

00;52;53;00 – 00;52;54;09
Kelly Parbs
Wow!

00;52;54;12 – 00;53;03;19
Jeff Anderson
So there was not a dry eye in that house. And, you know, I just, that’s the miracle of animals, I think, you know.

00;53;03;22 – 00;53;14;20
Kelly Parbs
Absolutely! That’s really just a testimony to how dogs can so beautifully and tenderly help people in a way that sometimes even skilled, trained professionals can’t!

00;53;14;23 – 00;53;39;19
Jeff Anderson
Yeah, yeah. And like you said, you know, I mean, yeah, you just you just an animal. You, you know, I, I always joke that my little Malinois, she has yellow eyes, but to me, they look right through to your soul. You know, she looked at you and you’re like, okay, okay. You. Yeah. And, I, I, I think it’s pretty neat thing, you know.

00;53;39;22 – 00;54;13;13
Kelly Parbs
Sure is. I was talking to a friend about doing this podcast and she told me that at her church, they have a ministry comfort dog. And this dog is available at Vacation Bible school, youth group events and more, and is so very popular. And one of the things that I learned from thinking about doing this podcast is that emotional support dogs and service dogs are very different, and that’s something I never really understood. Can you help us clearly understand?

00;54;13;16 – 00;56;39;05
Jeff Anderson
Well, by and- by law. By law, very, very different by law. An emotional support dog has no right as far as public access airplanes. You, you have no rights. Like, if you have an emotional support dog, it’s literally supposed to fly under the belly of the airplane- with, in the belly of the aircraft, not up front with you. And, and the same thing with public access into restaurants and things like that. It’s an emotional support animal. It’s not a service dog. Even though for people that have PTS, that is the service, right? To treat that pets and give them the confidence and the self-worth and all those things. But, you know, one of the questions that people could ask you is, what service does that dog do for you? And what- and how does that alert you? I mean, you can ask both of those questions. They can’t ask you what’s wrong with you because it falls under HIPAA. So, you know that, a therapy dog is just that. It is they are emotional. You know, maybe you feel better when you have your dog with you. Maybe, you know, you can go out in public and things like that. I, I actually have a recipient. He’s an older gentleman. He’s in Utah, but his daughter had cancer and she had a little tiny. Oh my goodness, that thing weighed 3 pounds. But she had that dog everywhere with her. And that was her emotional support dog to get through all those rounds of chemo and all those rounds of, you know, radiation and, all the treatments, he was using treatments a couple times a week. But she had those dog, that dog with her, and that dog was so well behaved and, you know, and I was like, well, you know, that dog does more for her than any of my dogs. You know, they’re all the same. Right?

00;56;39;08 – 00;56;47;21
Kelly Parbs
Is there any kind of training for an emotional support dog, or really, can any dog that provides emotional support be labeled that way?

00;56;47;23 – 00;57;38;08
Jeff Anderson
Well, you know, I mean, again, at at a minimum. At a minimum. By basic command and along down say and yeah, every, every dog ought to have that anyway, right? But if you’re going to, if you’re going to claim that your dog is a trained dog, elite paid time to train. And, you know, I mean, again, that everybody loves a well-behaved dog, you know, and nothing’s worse than being in a room with an unruly beast, you know? Yeah. So, I, I don’t I don’t know of any facilities. I’m sure there are, but I don’t know of anybody that trains emotional support dogs.

00;57;38;10 – 00;57;43;19
Kelly Parbs
Well, that’s something maybe I’ll have to look into further. And maybe I’ll do another podcast on emotional support dogs.

00;57;43;22 – 00;57;45;25
Jeff Anderson
There you go!

00;57;45;25 – 00;58;04;16
Kelly Parbs
Jeff, I have such a deep and respect for the work that you do and the work that these service dogs do. I am paying attention to time, and I’m seeing that we probably should start wrapping up here. But before we do, are there any specific messages that you would like our listeners to take away from this podcast?

00;58;04;19 – 00;59;08;17
Jeff Anderson
I guess the the biggest one for me is when you’re dealing with veterans, just realize that not every scar is visible and it’s not. And, I’m sitting here before you. I just recently got out of the hospital, and so when you look at me, I look fine. But, I’m telling you, a month ago, I was not fine, and, but we we have a lot of guys who, you know, you mentioned all the things. Anger, wanting to be by themselves, all the withdrawal and withdrawing from society and all those things. And they look regular. They look normal, but then they’re having issues and, you know, they I think the, the biggest thing you could do is just be friendly, be courteous, be kind. I’m telling you, I’m not the man I was ten years ago. And Rebuilding Warriors has really softened me up. And I’m- I’m really happy for that! I think that that’s the biggest lesson.

00;59;08;19 – 00;59;16;14
Kelly Parbs
Well, thank you for opening our eyes to the world of service dogs. I so appreciate the time that you spent with me today, Jeff!

00;59;16;17 – 00;59;33;27
Jeff Anderson
Oh thank you! Thanks for having us. And hopefully somebody get something out of it. But, just once again, we’re Rebuilding Warriors, rebuildingwarriors@gmail.com is my email. We’re located in Madisonville, Texas.

00;59;33;29 – 00;59;35;25
Kelly Parbs
Hopefully people will check out your website!

00;59;35;28 – 00;59;39;26
Jeff Anderson
We can help you out, yes! Please do, please do!

00;59;39;28 – 01;00;14;29
Kelly Parbs
Thank you for taking time to talk with me today, Jeff. Our listeners and I learned so much, and I especially appreciate feeling more aware of proper etiquette for when I cross paths with a service dog. To hear more episodes of OnTopic with Empathia, visit our website, www.Empathia.com. Follow us on social media @Empathia, and subscribe to OnTopic with Empathia to hear new episodes as soon as they go live. I’m your host, Kelly Parbs – thank you for listening to OnTopic with Empathia!